Fruit of the loom

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John Marshall
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Fruit of the loom

Postby John Marshall » Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:03 pm

Well after a couple of days replacing the coils and tidying up some paint,I went to ride off on this R75/7 and it became reluctant to fire up where it had been fine.Eventually running but as soon as I let the clutch out it cut out. All warning lights were off.Then they came back on so I started the bike and ran it up a nearby hill,it then cut out with zero electrics so I rolled back to the drive.
I have waggled the kill switch but no lights or ignition.Battery is brand new and has plenty of poke.I bypassed the earth with a jump lead and then pulled the headlamp.The circuit board looks new and the wiring seemed tidy. Operating the ignition key in the switch removed from the bike,showed continuity from the t30 red wire with the key in park to the t15 and then when the key was turned again to the grey and main lighting so this looks to be ok.
As I have been working under the tank it might be prudent to check there.I had used the kill switch yesterday having started the bike with the tank off to check my coil wiring was working and it ran properly albeit on little fuel.
Can I just check if the kill switch was at fault would I expect no warning lights no parking lights and no ignition. I have a similar bike R60/7 but that kill switch has never functioned so I cannot cross check.
I will try and bypass the switch and not lose the ballbearing in the rose garden when I open it.I may have a spare but cannot remember.
Of all the elements of a motorcycle its the electrics that I have the least innate ability with. It may of course be a dodgy red wire which I have disturbed
As its 7 degrees I have withdrawn to the house to watch MOTOGP and plan the next phase.

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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby John Marshall » Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:08 pm

I have checked the fuses are sound with my multimeter as well.
Anyway any useful pointers will be gratefully received.I will say that after 1xC15, 1x A65, 1 x T150,1xT160,1x Guzzi le Mans,1x T140,1xR65,1xR60/7 1x R100RS and 1x Morini 350 this is the FIRST time I have ever had complete electrical loss. Maybe I was just lucky.

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Rob Frankhamr
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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby Rob Frankhamr » Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:21 pm

As a first observation...
If the fault affects all circuits, then it must be in a witing path that is common to all circuits... in oter words, it really must be in the earth circuit or in the positive feed from the battery to the ignition switch.

As a first port of call, I would check the starter relay connections. For some reason, BMW chose to feed all of the current from the battery to to ignition switch through two terminals on the relay both marked 87 and joined together within the relay. If this feed is disrupted by dirty. broken or loose connections, there will be no power to any circuit on te bike.

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John Marshall
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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby John Marshall » Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:54 pm

Hi Rob
I was getting to this view.I will see what tomorrow brings,It's just as I was working on those coils and the main wiring loom was rerouted slighty it's a bit suspicious.I can swap my other starter relay if needs be.
Anyhow hope I can solve it !
John

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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby Roy Gavin » Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:47 am

The loom earth at the frame near the regulator can cause problems too.
Mine was through one of the screws on a plastic bodied regulator, so all I had was a couple of threads on a rusty and loose PK screw.

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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby windmill john » Mon Apr 15, 2019 8:20 am

My R80/7 did this and as Rob has intimated I had a bad/broken connection where the large red feed entered the relay on the left hand side of the frame backbone under the tank. I jammed in a little bit or wood to hold the connector in place, never went wrong again.
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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby John Marshall » Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:29 am

Wood is good. I use a piece of hardwood to pad out the much thinner battery I use,It’s about the size of a PC680 odyssey.
Anyway I went out to the bike at 0612 today,removed the tank, reconnect the earth and everything’s working. I removed the starter relay all seems clean and so does the plug, I cannot now induce electrical failure by waggling any leads including the earth strap or repeatedly flicking the kill switch and tapping all likely areas.nothing looks to be rubbing the tank and no control cables are touching anything they shouldn’t. to quote Rik Mayall “ stranger than truth,except that it’s true.” I wanted to find something.
I am now nervously going to ride up a steep hill by my house.
John

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CharlieVictor
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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby CharlieVictor » Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:23 pm

From the title I feared this was a thread about men underwear. What a relief...
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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby Mjolinor » Mon Apr 15, 2019 5:12 pm

From the title I feared this was a thread about men underwear. What a relief...
Let's have more threads about men's underwear.

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Galactic Greyhound
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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby Galactic Greyhound » Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:13 pm

From the title I feared this was a thread about men underwear. What a relief...
Let's have more threads about men's underwear.

Long, short or brief? :lol:
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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby Mjolinor » Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:49 pm

From the title I feared this was a thread about men underwear. What a relief...
Let's have more threads about men's underwear.

Long, short or brief? :lol:
Well given the quality of the drivers one has to avoid I was thinking along the lines of absorbance and smell retention really.

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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby John Marshall » Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:57 am

After a few miles,round and about,stopping,shopping and back,no more problems. Thinking about it the most likely cause would be a suspect wire which having repositioned the loom after fitting new coils and then cable tied to the top tube was enough to break the circuit. However the starter relay could be going faulty. I can see under the plug,where the wiring enters,can I remove these for inspection as they seem to be locked into the plug.Some kind of tab to depress to release them perhaps.? I don’t fancy being stranded but without a firm diagnosis I will be worrying. John

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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby John Marshall » Tue Apr 16, 2019 9:23 am

Ok bit of YouTube time suggests a fine screwdriver or 2mm Allen key inserted should push the tab back on the spade terminal, so I will acquire a new dual 87 relay then attack it. this retirement thing is a godsend as is wife on holiday in Spain. still I have bought the paint,just not applied it.

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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby John Marshall » Tue Apr 16, 2019 9:11 pm

And finlly ( I hope) I got a replacement starter relay from GSF car parts giving them the correct Bosch number for a fiver. Pulled the spade connectors out of the plug and cleaned them and checked continuity whilst wiggling the loom and finally fitted the new relay I took the trouble to use a small bit of some "plastic" sheet around it as a hedge against both leaking brake fluid and water ingress.
John

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Re: Fruit of the loom

Postby Roy Gavin » Wed Apr 17, 2019 1:41 am

Quick check on the contacts in the connector block is that there should be two visible lines on all of the pins on the relay where the " horns " on the Lucar? connector wipes against them - this is supposed to be a self cleaning function so slipping the relay in and out should clean them.
The relay block on the injected F650 is up behind the steering head and cops the sometimes salty road spray, which doesn't do the the pins much good, and has driven some owners to distraction.
The F650 relays were sometimes "known to be dud" items left over from a fiasco with the early K bikes, which didn't help much either!


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